b***@toast.net
2009-04-01 16:23:22 UTC
"Misquoting Isaiah 59:20-21"
The Lord's Apostle Paul (Acts 9:15)
in Romans 11:26, referring to Israel's future Restoration from her
current state of blindness to the future greatest People who have ever
been on the earth, "quotes" Isaiah 59:20 as:
"And so all Israel will be saved, as it is written: "The Deliverer
will come out of Zion, And He will turn away ungodliness from Jacob;"
However, in the NKJV, that passage reads,
"The Redeemer will come to Zion, And to those who turn from
transgression in Jacob," Says the LORD.
And the Tanach reads,
"He shall come as redeemer to Zion, to those in Jacob who turn back
from sin."
And Snow's version is similar to the latter two, where he accuses Paul
as above.
There is a SERIOUS difference in the above Romans 11:26, and the three
OT "quotations." The difference is: Who is the subject of the action?
The action of the turning from sin. Or, Who is the active party:
Jacob, or the Deliverer?
In Romans, the Subject is the Deliverer; HE turns away the
ungodliness. He is the active party.
But in the lower quotations of Isaiah 59:20, those in Jacob are the
subject; THEY are the active party.
One of the two is FLAT OUT WRONG! To determine which, we need to try
to get closer to the original Scripture, not flat out declare another
accusation against Paul, with no discussion whatever.
The translations from the Hebrew, such as the Tanach and the NKJV
above, and the KJV, and Snow's version, come from what is known as
the Masoretic. The Masoretic was produced around 700 - 1000 AD.
Romans 11:26 IS NOT A QUOTATION FROM THE MASORETIC. Making Snow's
accusation utterly false. Paul IS NOT "MISQUOTING." Most of the
"quotations" (I put this in quotes, because the subject of quotations
itself is very complicated and involved --- most so-called
"quotations" are not quotations at all --- almost none of them,
actually) from the OT in the NT are not from the Hebrew, far less from
the Masoretic, but from the Septuagint. The Septuagint is a Greek
translation from ancient Hebrew, and some Aramaic texts, done about
270 BC.
Besides the fact that the Septuagint (LXX) was endorsed by the Lord
Jesus and the Apostles, it has at least two more great advantages:
1. It is from a much earlier time; therefore by scholars who would be
much more familiar with the original Hebrew than the Masoretes would
have been.
2. It is from a time before Christ, and therefore free from the
anti-Messianic bias of the Jews since that time.
A good English translation from the Septuagint (from the Online Bible
software) of Isaiah 59:20 is
And the deliverer shall come for Sion's sake, and shall turn away
ungodliness from Jacob.
which matches Paul's "quotation."
Further, this also matches the Theology of the Bible, whereas the
Masoretic contradicts it. Throughout the Bible the teaching is that
"the heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who
can know it?"
Or, "can the leopard change his spots? Or the Cushite the color of
his skin? Then may ye also do good, that are accustomed to evil" ---
Jer. 13:23. Man, on his own, CANNOT DO GOOD! Whether Jew or Gentile.
"Behold, even the Heavens are not pure in His sight! How much more
abominable and filthy is man, that drinketh in iniquity like water,
day after day!"
I can testify that this is my experience; and it is yours as well. I
know what kinda guy you are: you're the same kinda guy I am! As Peter
said at the Jerusalem conference,
Acts 15:10 "Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the
neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to
bear?
11 But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we
shall be saved, even as they."
No honest person who perceives this would EVER blaspheme a man like
Paul, who when he was in Athens went into literal paroxysms from his
concern for the unsaved heathen there with their idols and ignorant
philosophies.
As in the NT every where asserted that man is incapable of
"repentance,"
"with man this is impossible; but with God all things are possible."
Or, no man can come unto Me except the Father, Who hath sent Me, draw
him."
Israel's restoration is going to be solely of the Lord, just as Paul
correctly "quotes" Isaiah 59:20, and contrary to the way the above
Hebrew renderings have it.
And the description of how that's going to come about is Prophesied in
Ezekiel 37-40.
Bob
Christ Died to Save You
The Lord's Apostle Paul (Acts 9:15)
in Romans 11:26, referring to Israel's future Restoration from her
current state of blindness to the future greatest People who have ever
been on the earth, "quotes" Isaiah 59:20 as:
"And so all Israel will be saved, as it is written: "The Deliverer
will come out of Zion, And He will turn away ungodliness from Jacob;"
However, in the NKJV, that passage reads,
"The Redeemer will come to Zion, And to those who turn from
transgression in Jacob," Says the LORD.
And the Tanach reads,
"He shall come as redeemer to Zion, to those in Jacob who turn back
from sin."
And Snow's version is similar to the latter two, where he accuses Paul
as above.
There is a SERIOUS difference in the above Romans 11:26, and the three
OT "quotations." The difference is: Who is the subject of the action?
The action of the turning from sin. Or, Who is the active party:
Jacob, or the Deliverer?
In Romans, the Subject is the Deliverer; HE turns away the
ungodliness. He is the active party.
But in the lower quotations of Isaiah 59:20, those in Jacob are the
subject; THEY are the active party.
One of the two is FLAT OUT WRONG! To determine which, we need to try
to get closer to the original Scripture, not flat out declare another
accusation against Paul, with no discussion whatever.
The translations from the Hebrew, such as the Tanach and the NKJV
above, and the KJV, and Snow's version, come from what is known as
the Masoretic. The Masoretic was produced around 700 - 1000 AD.
Romans 11:26 IS NOT A QUOTATION FROM THE MASORETIC. Making Snow's
accusation utterly false. Paul IS NOT "MISQUOTING." Most of the
"quotations" (I put this in quotes, because the subject of quotations
itself is very complicated and involved --- most so-called
"quotations" are not quotations at all --- almost none of them,
actually) from the OT in the NT are not from the Hebrew, far less from
the Masoretic, but from the Septuagint. The Septuagint is a Greek
translation from ancient Hebrew, and some Aramaic texts, done about
270 BC.
Besides the fact that the Septuagint (LXX) was endorsed by the Lord
Jesus and the Apostles, it has at least two more great advantages:
1. It is from a much earlier time; therefore by scholars who would be
much more familiar with the original Hebrew than the Masoretes would
have been.
2. It is from a time before Christ, and therefore free from the
anti-Messianic bias of the Jews since that time.
A good English translation from the Septuagint (from the Online Bible
software) of Isaiah 59:20 is
And the deliverer shall come for Sion's sake, and shall turn away
ungodliness from Jacob.
which matches Paul's "quotation."
Further, this also matches the Theology of the Bible, whereas the
Masoretic contradicts it. Throughout the Bible the teaching is that
"the heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who
can know it?"
Or, "can the leopard change his spots? Or the Cushite the color of
his skin? Then may ye also do good, that are accustomed to evil" ---
Jer. 13:23. Man, on his own, CANNOT DO GOOD! Whether Jew or Gentile.
"Behold, even the Heavens are not pure in His sight! How much more
abominable and filthy is man, that drinketh in iniquity like water,
day after day!"
I can testify that this is my experience; and it is yours as well. I
know what kinda guy you are: you're the same kinda guy I am! As Peter
said at the Jerusalem conference,
Acts 15:10 "Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the
neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to
bear?
11 But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we
shall be saved, even as they."
No honest person who perceives this would EVER blaspheme a man like
Paul, who when he was in Athens went into literal paroxysms from his
concern for the unsaved heathen there with their idols and ignorant
philosophies.
As in the NT every where asserted that man is incapable of
"repentance,"
"with man this is impossible; but with God all things are possible."
Or, no man can come unto Me except the Father, Who hath sent Me, draw
him."
Israel's restoration is going to be solely of the Lord, just as Paul
correctly "quotes" Isaiah 59:20, and contrary to the way the above
Hebrew renderings have it.
And the description of how that's going to come about is Prophesied in
Ezekiel 37-40.
Bob
Christ Died to Save You